Barry Humphries: 'Caitlyn Jenner is a publicity-seeking ratbag'

The 81-year-old may be a little paunchy, though he’s quite the fop in yellow trousers, a fedora and a blazer decorated with a sparkling brooch. The shocking thing about Humphries is how softly spoken he is – after all, we are so used to the Australian’s alter egos – the flamboyant Dame Edna Everage and the boorish Sir Les Patterson.

Humphries prefers to stay out of the spotlight and allow his creations do the talking. “Yes, it’s wonderful!” he beams. “Les can say what he likes. I can say: 'I disapprove of what Edna said the other night.’”

In an age of ever-increasing political correctness, he says, he needs to hide behind his creations. Not that he always does. Last year, he became involved in a very public row over the resignation of Barry Spurr, a Sydney poetry professor after private “racist” emails were published (Spurr said that they were a jokey “game” in which he and a friend tried to outdo each other in their use of outrageous language).

“It’s this new puritanism, isn’t it?” says Humphries theatrically. “It was a disgraceful persecution.”

Humphries does sometimes like to outrage as himself and enjoys the occasional tale of provocation.

“I had a Nazi friend – repentant, he wrote a book about his time in the SS. When he died his widow said among his last words were: 'Zat Barry Humphries, ze Führer would have adored him.’” Why? “I have no idea,” he shrugs. “It’s hypothetical, since Hitler never actually met me, but I thought it would make a great strapline on a book.”

Humphries is not, he insists, particularly Right wing. “I don’t know anything about politics. But the far Left is so conservative, paradoxically, inflexible, doctrinaire and humourless. You can’t describe the world as it is any more. You get jumped on.” Does he? He chortles. “I’m happy to say I do. I give offence therefore I am. Not too much offence, though.”

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As an expat, Humphies is always grouped with fellow Australians Germaine Greer and Clive James. “I don’t mind; they’re friends,” he says. On the other hand, he disliked being linked to Rolf Harris. “He behaved evilly,” says Humphries. 

Greer attracted fury after claiming that “trans” women such as Caitlyn Jenner (formerly the Olympic athlete Bruce Jenner) are men “who believe that they are women and have themselves castrated”, with students at Cardiff University describing Greer as “transphobic” and someone who should make all right-minded people feel “sick to [their] stomachs”.

Humphries is supportive of Greer in the controversy. “I agree with Germaine! You’re a mutilated man, that’s all,” he says. “Self-mutilation, what’s all this carry on? Caitlyn Jenner – what a publicity-seeking ratbag. It’s all given the stamp – not of respectability, but authenticity or something. If you criticise anything you’re racist or sexist or homophobic.”

No wonder he is now finding comfort in the past. His new Radio 2 show, Barry’s Forgotten Musical Masterpieces, focuses on largely neglected recording artists from the past. “Al Bowlly, George Formby, Greta Keller,” he recites fondly. “And Fred Astaire, whom I regard as one of the great artists of the 20th century. Not only was he a great dancer, he was also a splendid singer and interpreted the songs of George and Ira Gershwin beautifully.”

As a boy growing up in Melbourne, their sounds, emanating from his parents’ wireless, captivated him. “It’s all about nostalgia for my own youth. The past is more reliable, though it’s a myth, of course, a romanticised period we inhabit it in our imaginations.”

This romanticisation was sorely tested when, after studying at the University of Melbourne, he briefly interned at EMI records, where they were making the transition from 78 rpm recordings to LPs. “For copyright reasons, the 78s had to be broken, so I was put in a subterranean room with no windows smashing up hundreds of records, every day, with a hammer. I felt terrible, I was traumatised.”

Humphries divides his time these days between London – where he lives with his fourth wife, Lizzie Spender, daughter of the late poet laureate Stephen, and a collection of 35,000 books – and Melbourne, where two of his four children and all five grandchildren live.

He arrived in London in 1959 and spent the Sixties in an alcoholic stupor (he’s now long sober), hanging out with the likes of Peter Cook, Dudley Moore and Alan Bennett. Was the capital swinging?

“Not as far as I could see,” he says firmly. Still, Humphries thinks the world is a “less attractive” place now as  “we’re more materialistic, greedier”.

Humphries is not, however, living in a nostalgic bubble. He’s a fan of most contemporary comedians (“though why aren’t there more women? Maybe it’s because they are smarter than men”), singling out Steve Coogan, Eddie Izzard, Harry Enfield and Rob Brydon. 

And what of Dame Edna, who’s now enjoyed several “farewell” tours but keeps making comebacks. “Talk of Edna’s retirement is very exaggerated,” says Humphries. “Dame Edna doesn’t like living in hotels, but she’s going to Chicago and Boston soon, so I guess I’ll be coming with her.”

Does he miss Edna when he’s not “with” her? Humphries looks reticent. “I don’t even think about her. I’m so busy doing other things.” He will never retire; performing, he says in his wistful way, offers another much-needed escape from reality. “I love being on stage. I love the company of an audience and also the solitude. It can be a full house and I will be on stage and I’ll think: 'Ah, alone at last!’”

Barry’s Forgotten Musical Masterpieces starts at 10pm on Radio 2, Jan 13